Просмотр кода страницы Цитаты: критика материалистической науки (Шрила Прабхупада)

== Наука на уровне чувств ==
[https://vedabase.io/ru/library/iso/9/ Ш́рӣ Ӣш́опаниш̣ад 9]

Люди, поглощенные плотскими наслаждениями, на языке «Бхагавад-гиты» (7.15) называются ''мудхами''. Это слово означает, что они так же невежественны и темны, как ослы, символ тупости. Люди, занятые бессмысленным удовлетворением чувств, по определению «Шри Ишопанишад», поклоняются ''авидье''. И те, кто поддерживают такого рода цивилизацию, называя это прогрессом просвещения, приносят гораздо больше вреда, чем те, кто живет только ради удовлетворения чувств. Прогресс науки безбожных людей так же опасен, как драгоценный камень на голове кобры. Кобра, украшенная драгоценным камнем, еще опаснее, чем кобра без украшения. В «Хари-бхакти-судходае» (3.11) научные достижения безбожных людей сравнивают с украшениями на мертвеце. В Индии, как и во многих других странах, некоторые люди придерживаются обычая провожать в последний путь украшенное тело покойника, чтобы хоть как-то утешить скорбящих родственников. Вся современная цивилизация представляет собой такую же жалкую попытку хоть как-то облегчить непрекращающиеся страдания материального существования. Вся эта деятельность направлена только на удовлетворение чувств. Но выше чувств стоит ум, выше ума — интеллект, а выше интеллекта — душа. Поэтому целью настоящего образования должно быть самоосознание, познание духовных ценностей души. Любое другое образование, не приводящее к пониманию природы своего «я», следует считать ''авидьей,'' невежеством. И культивировать его — значит опускаться в темнейшие области невежества. <nowiki>https://vedabase.io/ru/library/iso/9/</nowiki>

ISO 9.docx

'''In the language of the Bhagavad-gétä (7.15), people who are engaged in gross sense gratification are müòhas—asses. The ass is a symbol of stupidity. Those who simply engage in the profitless pursuit of sense gratification are worshiping avidyä, according to Çré Éçopaniñad. And those who play the role of helping this sort of civilization in the name of educational advancement are actually doing more harm than those who are on the platform of gross sense gratification. The advancement of learning by a godless people is as dangerous as a valuable jewel on the hood of a cobra. A cobra decorated with a valuable jewel is more dangerous than one not decorated. In the Hari-bhakti-sudhodaya (3.11.12), the advancement of education by a godless people is compared to decorations on a dead body. In India, as in many other countries, some people follow the custom of leading a procession with a decorated dead body for the pleasure of the lamenting relatives. In the same way, modern civilization is a patchwork of activities meant to cover the perpetual miseries of material existence. All such activities are aimed toward sense gratification. But above the senses is the mind, and above the mind is the intelligence, and above the intelligence is the soul. Thus the aim of real education should be self-realization, realization of the spiritual values of the soul. Any education which does not lead to such realization must be considered avidyä, or nescience. And to culture such nescience means to go down to the darkest region of ignorance.'''

аксиоматические различия

Room Conversation. June 18, 1975, Honolulu

Prabhupada: Yes. So all the scientists, therefore, we say fool. They do not know this. Then? We do not accept accident, and they do not accept divine. So this is our position. We won't accept their foolish talk based on accident, and they will not hear us because we talk of divine God. Hah... Because they always say, "Don't talk of divine." This very word, as soon as you say "divine," so he will take it, "Oh, he is a divine man."  That is their mentality. You cannot talk even of God or divine. 

Bali-mardana (reading his essey): "In the last 150..e," This is the Darwinism essay. "In the last 150 years, modern science has wrought many changes upon human civilization. The most significant deal with our conception of life and place within its vast scheme. The ideas of Charles Darwin epitomize the revolution of thought that has accompanied the expansion of the role of science in our lives. Science now replaces God as the object of our worship, and man lives for the here and now rather than the hereafter. The ideas of Darwin have never been proved as being more than a theory, yet millions accept them as fact. In discussing their influence and implications I shall suggest an alternate explanation of life, which does not depend on imperfect human speculation but is of '''divine origin'''. '''It is uniquely theistic, as well as rational and scientific'''.

During the late 1800s Christian doctrines concerning natural science came increasingly under attack. Unable to hold science at bay with its literal interpretations of the Bible, Christianity tried to adjust its theology to scientific change. The scientific community, increasingly materialistic, saw that the time was right to attack the faith of man and God and establish science as the new deity, and scientists as its priests. The battle continues today by promises of life from the laboratory and immortality within the fleshy body. Mankind is hypnotized and deluded, thinking his origin as a molecular accident and his destiny as a god in his self-fashioned paradise."

Prabhupada: They base their..y, molecular accident. Their science begins from accident. It that a very scientific proposal? Is accident scientific? They have admitted that from the very beginning of science, accident. And how it is scientific? Accident may take or may not take. So where is the science? What do they say? They do not say anything about it? But who will question? Accident, how it is scientific? The basic principle is wrong. Accidents. What is this nonsense, "accident"?


аксиоматические различия

Разговор в комнате. 18 июня 1975 г., Гонолулу

Прабхупада: Да. Поэтому мы говорим, что все ученые — глупцы. Они этого не знают. Тогда? Мы не принимаем случайность, а они не принимают божественное. Такова наша позиция. Мы не примем их глупые разговоры, основанные на случайности, и они нас не услышат, потому что мы говорим о божественном Боге. Ха... Потому что они всегда говорят: «Не говори о божественном». Как только вы произнесете это слово «божественный», он воспримет его как «О, он божественный человек». Таков их менталитет. Нельзя говорить даже о Боге или божественном.

Бали-мардана (читает свое эссе): «В последние 150 лет...» Это эссе о дарвинизме. «За последние 150 лет современная наука внесла множество изменений в человеческую цивилизацию. Наиболее значительные из них касаются нашего понимания жизни и места в её обширной системе. Идеи Чарльза Дарвина олицетворяют собой революцию мысли, которая сопровождала расширение роли науки в нашей жизни. Наука теперь заменяет Бога как объект нашего поклонения, и человек живёт для настоящего момента, а не для загробной жизни. Идеи Дарвина так и не были доказаны как нечто большее, чем теория, тем не менее миллионы людей принимают их за факт. Обсуждая их влияние и последствия, я предложу альтернативное объяснение жизни, которое не зависит от несовершенных человеческих предположений, а имеет божественное происхождение. Оно уникально теистично, а также рационально и научно.

В конце 1800-х годов христианские доктрины, касающиеся естественных наук, всё чаще подвергались нападкам. Не в силах сдержать науку с её буквальным толкованием Библии, христианство пыталось адаптировать свою теологию к научным изменениям. Научное сообщество, всё более материалистичное, увидело, что настало время атаковать веру человека и Бога и утвердить науку как новое божество, а учёных — как новых богов. как его жрецы. Битва продолжается и сегодня, обещая жизнь из лаборатории и бессмертие в телесной оболочке. Человечество загипнотизировано и обмануто, думая, что его происхождение — молекулярная случайность, а судьба — бог в созданном им самим раю.

Прабхупада: Они основывают свои… ну, молекулярные случайности. Их наука начинается со случайности. Это очень научное предположение? Является ли случайность научной? Они признавали это с самого начала науки — случайность. И как это может быть научно? Случайность может сработать, а может и нет. Так где же наука? Что они говорят? Они ничего об этом не говорят? Но кто будет задавать вопросы? Случайность, как это может быть научно? Основной принцип неверен. Случайности. Что это за чепуха, «случайность»?



аксиоматическое построение науки

"Life Comes From Life" Slideshow Discussions. July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.

Svarupa Damodara: It is also further described about this Absolute Truth as vadanti tat tattva-vidas... [SB 1.2.11].

Prabhupada:  If somehow or other one knows the Absolute Truth, then he knows everything. Yasmin vijnate sarvam etam vijnatam bhavati [Mundaka Upanisad 1.31.3]. That is the benefit of knowing the Absolute Truth. So a devotee knows everything. How it is possible? That is explained in Bhagavad-gita [Bg 10.11]

One may challenge, "How a person can know everything?" So Krsna immediately replies that "I help him specifically." Tesam evanukampartham. "Just to show My personal, especial favor upon him, I light up the torch of knowledge, and he knows everything." So if Krsna helps one to know everything, who can check it? That is not possible. His sanction is there. We are not all-powerful. Krsna is all-powerful means He can do everything.

[SB 1.2.11] That is the Absolute. Go on.

Svarupa Damodara: Now these statements are quite scientifically valid and sound. Now this will be verified in our next slide that is called the axioms. This is called structure of a theory. In scientific disciplines, physics, specifically in mathematics, now scientists work with a beginning called axioms. There are two types of axioms. First one is logical axiom, and the second one is theoretical axioms. Now from these axioms, by inference, actually one deduces these theorems. That's in the second block. From there, by observation, we have this object of study. Now the basic question is wherefrom these axioms coming from? The starting point, axioms, they take it for granted, and actually there is no proof. It is beyond proof, beyond any scientific proof.

Prabhupada: '''Vedanta-sutra, that is all axiom'''. Axiomatic truth.

Svarupa Damodara: So the way that science works, also they depend on axioms. But actually, when one analyzes this a little thoughtfully, one should come to the conclusion that actually these axioms are coming from the Absolute. So our first proposition, that '''in order to understand life and matter one must have this, er, some knowledge of the Absolute Truth, is scientifically sound.'''



Room Conversation. October 11, 1977, Vrndavana

Dr. Kapoor: [laughing] That can be a subject for discussion by itself. All the modern scientists are taking to philosophy, because there comes a stage in scientific investigation, you see, where you cannot but philosophize. You see?

Madhava: Yes. But the philosophers cannot continue in their own speculations.

Dr. Kapoor: What is philosophy? Philosophy is not thinking in vacuum. Philosophy is systematic thinking. It is systematic thinking. The scientists must be systematic. And...

Prabhupada: The scientists... Without systematic, how it is science?

===== догматизм =====
Бхагавад-гита, 2.11. 1 октября 1975 г., Маврикий

Вы — ученый. Как вы можете отрицать Бога? Какой же вы тогда ученый? Если Библия ошибочна — отбросьте ее. Я не возражаю. Но вы — ученый. Как вы можете отрицать Бога? В этом и заключается наш довод. Придите к пониманию этой логики: «Как мы можем отрицать Бога?» Вы утверждаете, что жизнь возникает в результате химических соединений. Сделайте это в лаборатории. Вы не можете этого сделать. Зачем вы распространяете ложные сведения? Какой же вы ученый? Значит, вас тоже нужно гнать в шею. Если Библию нужно отбросить, то и вас нужно отбросить. Почему вы настаиваете на своем статусе? Сначала докажите. Соедините химические вещества и создайте жизнь. А поскольку вы ведете ложную пропаганду, вас следует гнать прочь. Они говорят: «Мы сделаем это в будущем». А что такое будущее? Зачем же вы сейчас распространяете ложь? Подождите будущего. Чек с отсрочкой платежа: «В будущем я заплачу» — кто примет такой чек? Разве что какой-нибудь глупец.

Интервью и беседа. 8 июля 1976 г., Вашингтон (округ Колумбия)

Прабхупада: Это догматизм. Это не наука, это догматизм. Рупануга: Он не смог обосновать свои утверждения. Прабхупада: Это догматизм — можно нести любую чушь, но философия и наука — это разные вещи. Если он рассуждает с позиций догматизма, то какова ему цена? Что он имеет в виду, говоря «душа есть» или «души нет»? Как он это доказывает? Беседа в комнате. 6 июля 1976 г., Вашингтон (округ Колумбия). Сварупа Дамодара: Думаю, они заходят слишком далеко. Что касается науки как таковой, то лично я считаю, что она не так уж плоха... Прабхупада: Нет-нет. Их плохо учили. Не всех. Сварупа Дамодара: Они сделали много хорошего. Прабхупада: Мы это уже признали. То, что я вижу на десять футов вперед — пусть это будет моей заслугой, я могу это себе приписать. К чему эти слова: «Я вижу всю Вселенную»? Что за вздор? Говорите правду: «Мы создали механизм, и, согласно моим расчетам...» Всё это — пустая болтовня. Я утверждаю: вы не способны видеть дальше чем на десять футов. Почему же вы заявляете, что видите всё небо? Именно против этого мы и возражаем. Вы видите на десять футов — вот и приписывайте себе эту заслугу, только и всего. Если кто-то изготовил электрическую лампу — прекрасно, пусть гордится этим. Но если он заявляет: «Я могу создать Солнце», — такого человека нужно бить башмаками. Это же бред. Признавайте свою заслугу в том, что сделали хорошую электрическую лампочку, — это нормально. Но зачем утверждать: «Я могу создать Солнце»? Именно такие заявления они и делают, бросая вызов Богу. Мы выступаем с протестом, поскольку проповедуем сознание Бога. В противном случае — пусть занимаются чем угодно, какое нам до этого дело? Но мы не можем мириться с тем, что они бросают вызов Богу. Мы обязаны разоблачать их.

Bhagavad-gita 2.11. October 1, 1975, Mauritius

You are a scientist. How you can deny God? Then what kind of scientist you are? The Bible has done wrong. Throw it away. I have no objection. But you are scientist. How you can deny God? And that is our point. Come to this logic, that "How we can deny God?" You are speaking that from chemical combination life is formed. Do it in the laboratory. You cannot do it. Why you are propagating false propaganda? What kind of scientist? Then you are also to be kicked out. If Bible is to be kicked out, you are also to be kicked out. Why you are claiming your position? You prove first of all. You combine chemical and produce a life. And you are making false propaganda, so you are to be kicked out. They say, "We shall do in future." And what is the future? Then why you are at present making false propaganda? Wait for the future. Post-dated check: "In future I shall pay," who will accept this check? Any nonsense will accept.

Interview and Conversation. July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.  

Prabhupada: This is dogmatic. This is not scientific; it is dogmatic.  Rupanuga: He could not support his statements.  Prabhupada: So dogmatic, you can say any nonsense, but philosophy and science is different. If he's talking on dogmatic platform, then what is his value? What does he mean by "soul is there" and "soul is not there"? How does he prove?  Room Conversation. July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.  Svarupa Damodara: I think they are going a little too far. The science as such, personally I also feel that they are not all that bad...  Prabhupada: No, no. They're badly trained up. Not all.  Svarupa Damodara: There are many good things that they have done.  Prabhupada: That we already admitted. That I can see ten feet, let me credit, take credit for that. But why shall I say, "I can see the whole universe." What is this nonsense? Speak the truth. "Now we have manufactured machine, and this, I have calculation that..." All talking nonsense. I say it is not possible for you to see beyond ten feet. Why you are claiming that you can see the whole sky? That is our protest. You can see ten feet, take that credit, that much. If somebody manufactures the electric lamp, all right. Take this. But if he says, "I can manufacture the sun." Then he is to be beaten with shoes. Talking nonsense. You take this credit, that you have manufactured nice electric bulb, that's all right. But why you claim that, "I can manufacture the sun"? That is their claim, defying God. Because we are explaining God consciousness, therefore we are protesting. Otherwise let them do all nonsense, what business we have got. But we cannot tolerate when they challenge God. We must expose them.

ложный престиж лабораторий

Room Conversation with Press Representative. March 21, 1975, Calcutta

Scientists' role -- not only scientists -- scientists, philosopher, politician, everyone should endeavor that "Wherefrom we got these propensities? Where is the origin?" That is described in the Vedanta-sutra: athato brahma-jijnasa. I am a scientist. I am thinking of myself very great man, but I do not think that "Who is that great scientist under whose order the sun, moon, the sea, ocean, everything is working very properly?" I am thinking of that water is created by hydrogen, oxygen, but I do not inquire, "Wherefrom such hugh quantity of hydrogen, oxygen came, so that there is big oceans and seas, water?" That I don't enquire. So I am so foolish scientist. I am theorizing. I am theorizing that life has come from matter, chemical composition. But as soon as I ask that "I give you the chemical. You create," he says, "That I cannot do." This is going on. But our business is, we Krsna conscious, that we see that you scientists, you are trying to create a living being, but I glorify the Supreme who has already created millions and millions of living beings. I give you credit that... I cannot give you credit unless you create. But still, as you are thinking that you will be able in future, that's good... But what credit you will have? If I have got millions of rupees, and if you create ten rupees, then what is your credit, even if you create? You cannot do it. You will never be able to create life. That's a fact. That we know. But even if you are able to create, then what credit you, do you get? This is... Already there are millions and trillions of life. Why you are so proud that '''"We are going to create in the laboratory, life"? Why this false prestige?'''

== Разделение науки и религии ==
'''Bhagavad-gita 7.1–3. September 10, 1973, Stockholm'''

'''Because it is a science. Religion means a kind of faith. It is not faith. It is a science. Science must be based on logic and philosophy. Science means that. And religion means sometimes sentiments. So religion without philosophy is sentiment, and philosophy without religion is mental speculation. Both must be combined. Then it is perfect.'''  '''You cannot have religion without philosophy. That is sentiment, fanaticism. And if you simply take philosophy without religion, without sense of God, this is mental speculation. So religion must be on the basis of science and logic. That is first-class religion.'''

== Сциентизм приводит к атеизму ==
Bhagavad-gita 9.2. March 7, 1972, Calcutta

janmady asya yato 'nvayad itaratas carthesv abhijnah svarat

tene brahma hrda ya adi-kavaye muhyanti yat surayah

tejo-vari-mrdam yatha vinimayo yatra tri-sargo 'mrsa

...sada nirasta-kuhakam..., satyam param dhimahi

These are the description. So there is spiritual world. There is spiritual world. And there is spiritual body, sac-cid-ananda-vigraha, Krsna, sac-cid-ananda-vigraha [Bs 5.1]. So all this to be learned through bhakti-yoga. We cannot learn by speculation. That is not possible. That is jada-vidya. Jada-vidya. It is raja-vidya. Jada-vidya will not help you to understand Krsna. That will not help. No. Bhaktivinoda Thakura said, jada vidya sab mayara vaibhava. By advance of material science you are simply increasing the paraphernalia of this maya, illusory energy. Jada-vidya sab mayara vaibhava, tomara bhajane badha. The more one become materialistic scientist, he, he defies God: "Hah. That is not. We, we believe in science, believe in science.<nowiki>''</nowiki> But what is your science perfection? That is a different subject matter. But the difficulty is, at the present moment especially, the more one becomes advanced in this material knowledge, he becomes atheist. He becomes disbeliever.

===== Современность и научный атеизм =====
Evening Darsana. December 3, 1976, Hyderabad

Prabhupada: The modern scientists, their first business is to deny that Supreme. That is modern. It is a curse for the scientist if they talk of God. Amongst the scientists this is an etiquette, not to talk of God. Everything science. Means everything nonsense, passing on as scientist.

===== Коммунизм и атеизм =====
Room Conversation with Raymond Lopez, Wally Strobes, Bob Bourne. May 22, 1975, Melbourne

Prabhupada: Yes, that is to be united first. That... First thing is that everyone should be convinced or understand clearly that everything belongs to God. But they have no conception of God even. That is... The whole human society at the present moment, majority, they are godless, especially the Communist. They don't acknowledge. The scientist, the philosopher, the scholars -- all godless. Scientists' special business is how to defy God. They say, "Science is everything. We can do everything by science. There is no need of God."... They say that "We shall solve everything by scientific advancement. We have done already." They say like that.... Just like there is a big theory, chemical theory. One big scientist... Big or small, whatever he may be, he has got a Nobel Prize... He is making the theory that life has come from chemicals, by chemical combination, chemical evolution. Darwin's theory is also of that. This is their... Big, big scientists, they are so fool that life has come from matter. Where is the proof? He was lecturing in California University, and there was one student, he is my disciple, he challenged him that "If you get the chemicals, whether you can manufacture life?" That answer was, "That I cannot say." Why? You are putting this theory, that life has come from chemical. So science means observation and experiment. Now experimentally prove that the chemicals have produced a life.

=== Пропаганда университетов ===
ISO.docx

'''''In the modern society, even a boy thinks himself self-sufficient and pays no respect to elderly men. Due to the wrong type of education being imparted in our universities, boys all over the world are giving their elders headaches. Thus Çré Éçopaniñad very strongly warns that the culture of nescience is different from that of knowledge. The universities are, so to speak, centers of nescience only; consequently scientists are busy discovering lethal weapons to wipe out the existence of other countries. University students today are not given instructions in the regulative principles of brahmacarya (celibate student life), nor do they have any faith in any scriptural injunctions. Religious principles are taught for the sake of name and fame only and not for the sake of practical action. Thus there is animosity not only in social and political fields but in the field of religion as well.'''''

Lecture Bengali. March 16, 1973, Mayapur

Crossing all sorts of reality with this material. Directivity with this material world whatever of conception it may be. And to learn that, isavasyam idam sarvam. [Iso mantra 1] The fundamental truth given in the Upanisad, Isopanisad, that: isavasyam idam sarvam, that everything there is the presence of the Supreme Entity and also the Supreme Lord with this conception we are to live in such a training house. I was told that in Back to Godhead one gentlemen he wrote that so-called universities and the colleges and the schools are slaughter houses, hmm? I'm very much pleased with this idea.

Pandal Lecture. November 20, 1971, Delhi

I wanted to speak to the Vice Chancellor, and I expected him today, but he did not come. This is our unfortunate. I do not know why he avoided, but never mind; you try to understand. Don't spoil your children. The '''modern educational system without any knowledge of Bhagavan''', I may tell you frankly, not only in India, everywhere, '''they are practically slaughterhouse.''' Because in our country, it is a different thing; at least we have got the Vedic culture at home if it is not in the schools.

But in other countries, because there is no bhagavata-dharma culture, the students, although they are provided with ample opportunity for education, the '''nicest educational system, nice building, nice facilities, everything nice, unfortunately the products are coming out frustrated, confused young men''', and some of them are called hippies. They are educated. They are coming from very nice aristocratic family. In Western countries, in comparison to our country, every home is aristocratic. At least their standard of living is so high. So what we call aristocratic, that is a common affair. So this mishappening is going on all over the Western countries. Some of them are joining us, but this is the problem.

===== Наука как религия, идеология =====
Slideshow Discussions "Life Comes From Life". July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.

Prabhupada: We see practically. The egg theory, we can see practically. It doesn't require millions of years.

Svarupa Damodara: So we want to completely wipe out this theory.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Svarupa Damodara: Actually, there is, if we think of not in terms of science, but just in terms of our day-to-day experience, in social, moral, ethical, all levels of consciousness, if one analyzes this a little carefully, the root cause of our complete ethical background at this time is mainly due to this theory that "You are from molecules, and when you finish your body you'll also go back to molecules. So don't worry about all these high-sounding philosophical words. You just enjoy whatever you want and do whatever you like to do." So this type of complete materialistic...

=== Продвижение современных технологий наукой и кризисы ===
Room Conversation with Reporter. March 9, 1975, London

People are, in this human form of life, especially meant for understanding God. Athato brahma-jijnasa. This is the Vedanta-sutra. So they are keeping them in darkness and teaching them technology, how to make cycle. That's all. The life is meant for understanding God, and they have been educated for making cycle and sewing machine. This is going on. Therefore there will be disaster. It is already there. Just like in America or any Western country, they have manufactured so many cars, and now they are flattering the Arabians, "Please give us oil." You see? Power crisis. And if they stop manufacturing, there is unemployment. And if they increase car, there is power shortage. So this dilemma, this modern civilization will have to meet this dilemma because they are going against the laws of God.

Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.5. October 27, 1976, Vrndavana

Hitopadesa 2525].

These four things, there is no need of university education. But at the present moment to go to university means how to gratify the senses very scientifically. Scientifically. How to steal scientifically. Does it require any scientific knowledge how to cut throat and how to steal? No. They require education for spiritual understanding, tad-vijnanartham, not this vijnanartham, this material knowledge. It doesn't require. It is simply a waste of time. This modern university education is simply a waste of time.

There was no education for even the vaisyas. There are four divisions: brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra. But vaisya and sudra, there is no need of education. The brahmanas, because they will guide the society, they require education. And the ksatriya, they will give protection to the society; therefore there was education guided by the brahmana. And for the vaisyas, krsi-goraksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma... [Bg 18.44]. Where is the education? He can see, learn from his father how the field is to be cultivated with a plow. He doesn't require. He can see. And fifty years ago we have seen that those who were in the lower status of life, they never sent their children to school. I have seen it. Never sent. "Oh, what is the use of wasting time? Better admit him in some working shop or in some business." The Marwaris still do that: "Please keep my son in your firm." And small children, by seeing... Just like our children, they are seeing this Deity worship, this kirtana -- they will learn. Similarly, those who have to work to earn their livelihood, mechanical or some, they can go to the... What is the use of wasting time to the..., going to the university? Scientific education for hammering? Hammering you can see. You take a hammer and go on. [laughs] What is the use of... Technical nonsense. They have invented technical... Does it require any education? No. Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet [Mundaka Upanisad "To learn transcendental subject matter, one must approach the spiritual master. In doing so, he should carry fuel to burn in sacrifice. The symptom of such a spiritual master is that he is expert in understanding the Vedic conclusion, and therefore he constantly engages in the service of the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

оружее

Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.26.18. December 27, 1974, Bombay

[SB 5.18.12]

This is the test. And Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita,

na mam duskrtino mudhah

prapadyante naradhamah

mayayapahrta-jnana

asuram bhavam asritah

[Bg 7.15]

So this is the test: na mam prapadyante. Krsna says, "Who does not surrender to Me? They are these classes of men." What is that? Duskrtinah: "Always engaged in sinful activities." Krti means meritorious. But they are engaged in manufacturing atom bomb, duskrtinah. Atom bomb means killing. But discover something by which man will not die. That they are dying -- so you have discovered some instrument to die quickly. So that is duskrtinah. Merit, he has got merit, but misuse the merit. The death is there. He would have lived for, say, sixty years, and you drop atom bomb -- in ten years or twenty years, finished. You cannot increase the duration of life. Therefore the so-called scientific, I mean to say, advancement, what is that? Duskrtinah: no benefit for the human society.


не брахманы а шудры

Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.20. November 8, 1976, Vrndavana

[break] ...it is advised to a brahmana that if, bad time comes, you can come to the position of a ksatriya or even up to vaisya, but never to the position of a sudra. This is dog's business. They are... At the present moment everyone is being trained up to become sudra, dogs. High education, big, big degrees, but if the dog is not appointed by a master, his all qualification useless. Therefore it is doggish civilization. And Aryan civilization means brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra. Sudra means one who cannot live independently -- he has to depend on some master -- he's a sudra. That's all. The brahmana should live by education, by knowledge. Everyone will honor them. They will give the advice to the sudras, er, to the ksatriyas. When Parasurama killed eleven..., twenty-one times all the ksatriyas, his father chastised him that "This is not the business of a brahmana. My dear son, you are so angry, you have killed all the ksatriyas and you have killed Kartaviryarjuna by anger. Oh, you have done great sinful activities. It is not the business of the brahmana. Therefore you should retire for some time and go to holy places to counteract your sinful activities." This was spoken to Parasurama by his father.

ради премии

Morning Walk. December 2, 1973, Los Angeles

Their real aim is how to get the Nobel Prize by cheating. That is their real aim. How an educated man, learned man, will cheat? So therefore my Guru Maharaja used to say that "This modern human society -- or always -- it is a society of the cheaters and the cheated." Somebody is cheating and somebody's cheated, and they have combined together to make a so-called civilization.

=== Ведическое образование ===
Lord Nityananda Prabhu's Avirbhava Appearance Day Lecture. February 2, 1977, Bhubaneswar

So if we actually want life, blissful life, then we must get out of this material existence. That is Prahlada Maharaja's instruction. Samudvigna-dhiyam. And if you remain in the material existence, you must suffer from anxiety. There is no excuse. So Prahlada Maharaja advises that hitvatma-ghatam grham andha-kupam vanam gato yad dharim asrayeta [SB 7.5.5].

If you... Real problem is anxiety. And this anxiety will continue so long you are material existent. Therefore the real life is to get out of this material... Hitvatma-ghatam. Atma-ghatam. Atma-ghatam means killing the soul. This material civilization is killing the soul. That... They have no information of the soul. They do not know how to become peaceful, how to become blissful. They are trying to be peaceful, bahir-artha-maninah, by external material energy. They are thinking by constructing big, big buildings, just like in Bhubaneswar they are doing, and having good, very big, big roads and motorcar, that is advancement of civilization. No. That is not advancement. That is increasing their anxiety. There is no solution of the anxiety. There is... Formerly that I was speaking. There was no university. The university was in the cottage -- Vyasadeva. Vyasadeva was writing Srimad-Bhagavatam and all the Puranas in a cottage. So university was there. Who can produce such literature as Vyasadeva has given? From any angle of vision, from literary point of view, from philosophical point of view -- everything, so perfect, every literature, Mahabharata, Puranas and Vedanta -- Veda-vyasa, he has given. So there was no need of university. It required clear brain. That was to be done by the brahminical qualifications: samo damo titiksa arjava, jnanam-vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava... [Bg 18.42].

== Деградация ученых ==
SB 1.16.21

Are you feeling compunction for the unhappy women and children who are left forlorn by unscrupulous persons? Or are you unhappy because the goddess of learning is being handled by brāhmaṇas addicted to acts against the principles of religion? Or are you sorry to see that the brāhmaṇas have taken shelter of administrative families that do not respect brahminical culture?

The brāhmaṇas are traditionally intelligent men, and thus they will be able to pick up modern education to the topmost rank, but as far as moral and religious principles are concerned, they shall be the most fallen. Education and bad character go ill together, but such things will run parallel. The administrative heads as a class will condemn the tenets of Vedic wisdom and will prefer to conduct a so-called secular state, and the so-called educated brāhmaṇas will be purchased by such unscrupulous administrators. Even a philosopher and writer of many books on religious principles may also accept an exalted post in a government which denies all the moral codes of the śāstras. The brāhmaṇas are specifically restricted from accepting such service. But in this age they will not only accept service, but they will do so even if it is of the meanest quality. These are some of the symptoms of the Kali age which are harmful to the general welfare of human society.

BV

Are you lamenting apparent learned words (devīm vācam) in brāhmaṇa families of bad conduct? Are you lamenting those of noble family born in royal dynasties which have no devotion to brāhmaṇas?

ШБ 1.16.21

Может быть, ты жалеешь несчастных женщин и детей, которых покинули бессовестные мужчины? Или ты несчастна оттого, что богиней знания (ва̄чам девӣм) распоряжаются брахманы (брахма-куле), склонные поступать вопреки принципам религии (кукарман̣и)? Или же ты опечалена, видя, как брахманы приняли покровительство родов правителей (ра̄джа-куле), которые не уважают брахманическую культуру (абрахман̣йе)?

К: Брахманы традиционно являются разумными людьми, и, таким образом, им нетрудно будет достичь высот современного образования, но в отношении моральных и религиозных принципов не будет никого ниже их. Образованность и дурной характер несовместимы друг с другом, но они будут уживаться вместе. Сословие правителей осудит заповеди ведической мудрости и предпочтет править так называемым светским государством. Так называемые образованные брахманы станут предметом купли и продажи для таких беспринципных правителей. Даже философы и авторы многих книг, объясняющих принципы религии, будут занимать высокие посты в правительстве, отвергающем все моральные кодексы шастр. Брахманам строго запрещено поступать на такую службу, но в этом веке они будут не только поступать на службу, но и заниматься самой презренной деятельностью. Таковы некоторые признаки века Кали, которые разрушают благосостояние всего человеческого общества.

БВ

Скорбишь ли ты о кажущихся учеными словах (девӣм ва̄чам) в семьях бра̄хманов с дурным поведением? Скорбишь ли ты о тех, кто происходит из благородных семей, но служит царям, не имеющим преданности бра̄хманам?
[[Категория:Цитаты]]
[[Категория:Бхактиведанта Свами Прабхупада]]
[[Категория:Науковедение]]